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David Fairchild & Drew Goodmanson on Shapevine

June 24, 2008

David Fairchild & Drew Goodmanson from Kaleo Church in San Diego were interviewed on Shapevine this afternoon. David & Drew both have solid ministry experience and background. They are both missional thinkers seeking to contend for the faith contextualized to their San Diego community. They are also servants of the universal church in developing tools and training contexts for advancing the gospel. I don’t have exact quotes, but here are my notes which contain the core ideas discussed.

A few years ago they moved from a centralized traditional style church to a decentralized church where relationships were built in people’s homes and communities. They lost about 1/3rd of the church in this transition. The members of the church now meet in homes throughout the community and gather in multiple locations in the city for worship/celebration on Sunday.

David: Many think that in making this change, the Sunday value is diminished, but David said that they have seen that there was less pressure on the Sunday meeting for both pastors and members. If Sunday was a ‘miss’ for them, then it didn’t ruin their week. Sunday is no longer an idol for Kaleo and it’s members, but rather part of the week for celebration.

We really wanted to re-think ministry and how we free people to live and worship in tangible ways. We encounter Christ while in community. This removes the pressure of the idol of the Sunday church service. The Sunday service is still valued, but as part of the church, rather than the focus. The sermon is then worked out contextually throughout the city.

Drew: We both had to say ‘yeah’ that we were willing to lose people and be better in the long run. We have been able to raise the bar of discipleship in this.

Moderator: ‘What are some practical ways that you can share with us that people can start transitioning?’

David: We want this to be understood, this is a scary endeavor. We are responsible for these people. We launched a ship with a group of people and then changed the direction of the ship. We moved from an experience consumption to an intellectual consumption (on Sundays).

Drew: Once people came in we had to convert them to mission. We had to remove centralized ministries beyond the Sunday service. (everything else gets pushed out through the community) We have been blessed by the guys at Soma in Tacoma. They have the ideas of identities and rhythms of life that they form around. They are simple, but powerful diagnostics for us to live it out.

David: Relieving pressure has been a theme for us. To have international missions, mentoring teens, work to the poor is moved from the same 20 people to others. Missions are now being done in their own missional context. To be part of the community doesn’t mean that you come on Sunday and someone decides what ministries you will be involved in.

The conversation moved to Triperspectivalism

David’s mic was scratchy and most of this moved to fast to take down notes well, but this is from Drew’s blog:

http://www.goodmanson.com/2007-05/31/triperspectivalism-multiperspectivalism-other-large-words/

http://www.goodmanson.com/2007-12/13/leadership-development-in-community-prophets/

Prophetic type – an emphasis on the unchanging truths of God’s character, the gospel message and the mission of the Church.
Priestly type – an emphasis on the care of the soul and caring for one another.
Kingly type – an emphasis on the tangible working out of the mission through structures, strategic thinking and hands on activity.

David: This is not a cheap gimmick, but is deeply theological.

Moderator: Which of these three types is missing in the American church?

Drew: This depends on the church. You can have prophets who are all about truth, but never care for anyone. You can have priests who love folks, but never bring truth. You can have kings who become program oriented and rely on mechanical systems. We have really had to grow ourselves in these areas. Because we are in Christ, we are perfect in Christ as prophet, priest and king.

Moderator: Talk about Renovo and Tentmaker Group

Drew: Renovo is a network of believers in a city who are looking at the seven centers of society. We are seeking to help people move from a privatized, housebroken belief who can train up Christians to see gospel change in these areas.

Tentmaker Group answers how to sustain people to do this. We now have a program that helps bi-vocational guys to start missional churches that do not have the pressure to go and get tithe dollars. It helps people transition into ministries and helps businesses get involved.

Total Church North American Conference is coming in August. From the website:

‘Total church is a way of thinking about church and mission in the 21st century which sees the local Christian community as integral to Christian living and Christian mission.’

Q&A

Q: Is it wise to have the priest as the primary person to lead a church plant?
A: I think it is definitely possible. We need to get away from planting a single person toward a team of prophet, priest and king.

Triperspectival Tendencies
Prophet – tendency toward pride
Priest – tendency to seek approval
King – tendency toward pragmatics

Q: Some guys are starting missional communities on college campuses. Should they be?
A: These are doing what is Christian. Sometimes these things occur because of a vacuum in the local church community. I would encourage each of them to get connected to a local church community. The idea that we don’t want to be part of a ‘local church’, but rather just a random group is dangerous because it often becomes a homogeneous affinity group. They need someone who can disciple them, challenge them theologically and discipline them. It is important that there is an air of humility in the whole thing.

Drew: Part of what it means to be the local church is to have elders. If you have two elders that are biblically qualified then that is great. Those offices are there for a reason and I would encourage a community to have them. We want our MC leaders to grow theologically, relationally, emotionally, etc. Our elders are over MC leaders and are in close relationship with them.

Drew: The church is a cause, a corporation and a community. As a community we care for one another. As a cause we move toward the marginalized. As a corporation, we guard the theological… (connection was lost here)

We have a place for covenant community where we use the ‘one anothers’ and covenant around the ‘one anothers’.

Q: You guys had to transition to a missional community. What would you say to the guys who are starting out and don’t have something to transition from. How would you speak to their holy discontent to start something?
A: We would want to see all these things start with humility. Get together with other people intentionally and discuss what it would look like to begin a new community of faith. Rather than start as a mouthpiece that tells everyone how we are going to do it, start with the community humbly. If you do this with gospel intentionality, people will always be attracted to it.

Q: Do you feel conflict in pursuing the MC model with A29?
A: At first we thought we might, but no. A lot of people are moving this way in the network.

Here are some links to initiatives that they have started, either through Kaleo or Monk Development which is run by Drew.

Tentmaker Group

Kaleo Counseling

Sermon Cloud

The Cloud Network

Ekklesia360

Church Planting Resources

Church Bootcamp

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2 Comments leave one →
  1. June 25, 2008 8:28 am

    bro I would love to connect with you and maybe Dodson and others and see how we could flesh this out. I really dig this philosophy and would love to implement it at Vista.

  2. June 25, 2008 3:23 pm

    Happy to connect anytime brother. Dodson is ahead of us in implementation and smarter than me. But we can also wrestle through it together.

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